Some theists, seem to believe, that there must surely need to be something “kind of spooky”, about certain aspects of the human nature. What i mean by my-use of the word spooky here, is for me to say that the theists have become so totally convinced of “a God” and the “a-devil” and this kind of “supernatural” evil and suchlike ,and/or the story of a talking snake, as described within the genesis account of the garden of Eden . IE = the fall of man
That some of these faithful folk, (to me) would seem, to have simply ceased altogether,to even bother to still consider, that there may perhaps still be some-other way,to help explain,some aspect of ongoing problems existing within the human nature.
1.They feel they see how humanity struggles
2.They then feel they are also able to connect that, with ideas contained within their own holy book
3.Therefore they feel that are also able see this “as confirmation”, of their faith
Yet this conclusion, is still the same, as just jumping to conclusion
Our friend Fisherman ,would be just one, of very-many theist, worldwide, whom seem (to me anyway) to have already come to this kind of conclusion.In this way (so im not trying to single Fisherman out). Seems to me,he is totally convinced that man is evil. And of the direct kind of evil like the holy books have proposed too. Evil by choice, and not via gene ,or by any distant link, to our past common ancestry
Like, in one thread on wikipeebia ,where we read how he says things like this
Quote Fisherman :Fri Apr 10, 2015 2:39 pm ” But one thing has not changed-human nature,we are still plagued by the same fears,temptations and lusts of our forefathers.we can still learn a lot from the ancient accounts of life thousands of years ago,and in some respects all our technology has produced is the ability to kill people by the tens of thousands at great distances than one at a time by hand to hand combat,and we call that ‘progress’…..
Pretty fascinating stuff really and as King Solomon said’there is nothing new under the sun’.And not to be overlooked is the fact they had a written language and education system to record it for us to debate it!”
See more here (my bold)
If we know how “humans are human”.Then why? would we even have good-reason to expect them to become anything so-much different, than being human.
What ever next?.Will? these theist, also start worrying over the fact, that we might also see, how the “dog nature” ,has also seemed to have remained much the same over time,by it remaining “rather dog-like” as well too.
Or? a horses nature.Might we? expect the horses nature, might suddenly change dramatically.
I cant see why. What? about the “spiders nature”.Might we? have any real-good reason. To figure, that perhaps one day,suddenly those mean spiders, might stop with eating fly’s
I cant see why. After all ,spiders are spiders. They evolved to become spiders,that is their nature,and they have managed to have survived in that way.
So then,why? would we good-reason expect anything so very different ,with us humans.
I mean, if science is correct, and its correct to say that the human and the Chimpanzee and the horse and tiger and spider and so on . All had a common-ancestor. In very distant times past
Then some of these aspects of ongoing problems, that the human-nature ,will also constantly throws at us too . Is then at-least somewhat understandable , yes ? . No ?? …
For indeed, there need not be anything “supernatural” about it. Nothing “spooky”
I mean , If the tiger and the chimp . Could be seen to still have some “problematic nature” , about their own “nature” too .And we human might share a past common ancestor,with them. Then why? would the theist, need to become so surprised, to also see that human-nature , would also still carry-along some form of “problematic nature” as well too
It stands to reason.Right?. That is unless we are just so-busy, with an act,of trying to elevate our own lives, as being so far-above what some other living beings lives are also about
Humans are mighty good at doing that kind of thing. For a number of reasons
The theist overlooks these very real possibilities. In much the same way that the theist Bruce Hales, and his exclusive brethren followers too, are also able to freely overlook the possibility, that what they conclude, may also be wrong
They all find it so easy to do. And all because of one thing. The fact that they are not even bothering to even begin to entertain the idea,that their belief might be wrong
Nope. Possibly,not even for a second
And in the much same way, that Hitler and all of Hitler’s “faithful” followers too.Had found it so-easy to overlook the nastiness in which they had all become involved. For very few among their group had even cared to consider,other possibilities . Far easier to just roll-on ,with the majority
If all primates, do have a common ancestor. And we would also know how “appalling” those chimps-nature, can sometimes be seen to be. And if we do have a common ancestor we these living beings. Then why oh why ? , would we have any good-reason , to expect, that us-humans might have evolved to be perfect beings
No good reason . Unless one were to concoct a story,including talking snakes, about God creating perfect humans , whom then chose evil . And so on
I feel theist have been far too-quick to stigmatize humanity in this way. Instead of focusing on trying to better-understand these issues, they just chose to burden and bury humanity, within these piles of guilt.They laid down the very foundation of their “faith”, within guilt, that has then also been cemented in time, within threat of hell as well too
Which then led on to patterns of judgement and condemnation ,of humanity, that led on to mega division and strife, that now leaves humanity, broken,within the many thousands of schisms and need-of different domination’s and flavors of Christianity, that now exist worldwide.
And one wonders.How? is humanity any better off . How? has this stupidly helped anything
I hasnt. If anything it’s helped to make matters far-worse. For now not only do we have the nature of imperfect humans. But now we also have the stupidy that comes along with bigoted ignorance.The kind of utter stupidity that has made humans find need to divide ,by religion , as well too
It has been very interesting,for myself (as an agnostic atheist) , to observe some ex eb over on wikpeebia , kind of implying that when all is said and done. God is love
If God is simply love . Then how? the hell will the addition of religion ever be so-helpful . Religion aids? love
Pffftttttt !!! .
Soon as religion. Doctrine . Has been added into the mix . Aspects of bigotry naturally creeps on in too
Because right-away , human nature isn’t thought of as being quite-ok.Quite “good-enough” Unless that human would also agree to become a human+religion
Religion is a form of bigotry, in and of itself. Religion is inherently bigoted
God cannot be love. While the evil nastiness of religion ,would also continue as the cancerous scourge, that it has always been .
What real hope? does humanity have, to learn how to begin to face up to reality, so as to then learn ,and thus grow
While there is still so-many (theists) , of whom have already convinced themselves to decide to believe, the opposite . They already have pre-installed within their own minds, the idea that humans are supernaturally evil
Much the same way, that women of whom have been continually coerced into believing the idea, that women , are less than what men are. Will then start actually believing it to be correct. And will thus way ,then also stop even bothering to question this idea anymore
This is what religion has done, unto humanity.
You know. There is about as much hope, as there also is too, that one day soon those exclusive brethren ,might some day wake-up , to reality of some other matters too
For that is how faith works. Blind faith. Faith that is founded on false foundations.
And we all forced to pay for it. Theists and atheists alike. When Fisherman dies with a huge big smile on his dial,in thinking that he is headed for his place in eternity. Atheists like myself, have already paid “a part” of the price of that smile. We pay in this life, by us also having our families ripped apart. By the fact that our lives, have been somewhat devalued, by the existence if religion
And someone like Fisherman would say. Well it wasnt meant to be that way. For God is love.
If God is love. God loves everybody.Then why? the hell is there any need whatsoever, for religion
As if love could ever have hope to begin to flourish,so much,among humans. While so many humans, would also still seem to be so-intent, with this silly idea, of trying to sort the weeds from the wheat (Matthew 13:30)
What did? they ever hope to achieve. To? all have become like-God’s ,unto themselves.
These folk are real-quick, to easily see, how stupid the exclusive brethren seem to be. Yet how many ? would stop to consider ,how the wider-Christianty , is also looking
Not many. If any.Both are spawned by the same kind of faith
What? if Jesus wasnt a believer. What? if Jesus was agnostic .Like someone like myself. Why? else would Jesus have good reason to be heard to cry-out on the cross, “My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?” (matthew 27:46)
That sounds like the earthly human words, of an agnostic.
And why? didn’t Jesus even know exactly when he would return. If he was ever indeed, of any intent, on claiming himself to be God.
At best ,ive observed some theist ,use of sophistry, in trying to suggest stuff,like Jesus at that time, was still only at the stage of being like a “semi”-God. A half-God . Or words, to that same effect
And yet with all these questions, that do exist. Some theist will still continue to remain gullible enough, to still continue to believe, in the existence of hell , and the idea of a judgement-day
As if it would be justice. That people would ever be condemned to hell. When the facts of these matters,are still so-questionable
What? kind of God is this. A Kim Jung-Un like God , perhaps ? . Why would one agree to worship this kind of God anyway. Simply because? he is all-powerful . Kind? of like a Kim Jung-Un figure also is too
Little wonder our eb family ,do also still remain under bondage, of fear. And yet, next breath, these folk will claim … God is love
Does love?, cast out fear .
There is other ideas available , for consideration. Some of it even involves aspects of science. If these theists were ever keen, to care to address the real possibility, that their faith-beliefs might even be wrong. They are freely available online. And are easily found.
So long as these theists would first decide, it was worthwhile ,to actively go take a look for them. For this information ,wont just fall into their lap,at church
I’ll post a few links below, that might be worthwhile investigating.
Quote : “Scientists Probe Human Nature–and Discover We Are Good, After All” See here
Quote : “Even Smith, the father of economics, best known for emphasizing self-interest as the lifeblood of human economy, understood that the concepts of self-interest and empathy don’t conflict.“See here http://greatergood.berkeley.edu/article/item/the_evolution_of_empathy#disqus_thread (my bold and underlining)
Quote : “Why we Help : The evolution of cooperation”See here http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-we-help-evolution-cooperation/